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Post by whemblycthulhu on Aug 7, 2019 10:46:15 GMT -5
I think the point behind cellphones is that they're part of how our culture is moving towards one of instant gratification. It's not that guns are everywhere or easy to get, it's that they've evolved into being perceived as the easy way out of all your problems. Oooh. Good point. |
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Post by whemblycthulhu on Aug 7, 2019 10:49:36 GMT -5
I don't understand how you could ever come to the conclusion that "both sides are bad" is a useful conclusion when one side is provably much worse than the other. Our conservatives here in Sweden do the same thing: far-sighted assholes have killed a bunch of people since 2000 in Sweden while the corresponding number killed by the far left is 0,and yet our equivalent of Antifa is what they want to focus on. Fucking own up to the fact that you have a disproportionately large bunch of violent shitheads killing people. We know there's people on the left who are assholes too, but your insistence on bringing that up is like a man looking at a forest fire racing towards his house and shrugging because his neighbour's shed burned down once. It shouldn't be too hard to just look at the numbers and realise something's wrong. Regarding the cellphone stuff, why is the US an outlier? We do have cellphones over here too you know. You can say "both sides are bad" when there are actual violence being perpetuated ON BOTH SIDES INDISPUTABLY. That's not delineating that one side or the other does MORE OF IT. I'm not making that equivocation. You guys are ignoring left wing violence and go straight to "whem is trying to argue both sides are equally bad"... when I DID NO SUCH THING! |
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Post by Disciple of Fate on Aug 7, 2019 10:53:18 GMT -5
Warren and Dayton are a false equivalence unless you can point out how exactly Warren has immersed herself in rethoric of the far left and what the political motive of the shooter was. I can wait, so far all I hear is a Fox News talking point.
As for the fact that you recognize extremist violence, great. Maybe now you can also recognize that identifying other factors that contribute to said extremism does nothing to absolve the perp of anything. The rape equivalency is just disgusting, you should be ashamed, Trump is not the fucking victim here...
Really, critics also contribute to the problem for calling out the problem, is that what you want to go for? Talk about slippery slopes!
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Post by whemblycthulhu on Aug 7, 2019 11:01:11 GMT -5
And once again, whem ignores what I'm saying because he has to live in the world of "both sides are equally bad." (Also, whem, since you have the memory of a fucking goldfish, trump has called for violence several times. Remember, he'll pay your legal fees if you punch a protestor! Or when he said Or or either of these or But yeah, totally never advocated or supported violence right? A) If you can't bring yourself to acknowledge that "your side" (whatever that is) has committed violence... then just admit you're a fucking hack. B) Do you take Trump literally or can you ascertain good faith ribbing here? (you can criticize that it's unbecoming... which I do, but that's not what we're discussing). If you take him literally... did you take Obama's "Bring a gun in a knife fight" literally? Or, "Argue with your neighbor, get in their face". Or is it simply that you take any phrase by a political opponent in the most unflattering way because you're a political hack? I'll take the latter... God bless. |
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Post by whemblycthulhu on Aug 7, 2019 11:14:37 GMT -5
Warren and Dayton are a false equivalence unless you can point out how exactly Warren has immersed herself in rethoric of the far left and what the political motive of the shooter was. I can wait, so far all I hear is a Fox News talking point. For those who "links" El Paso to Trump... and ignores the same "links" the Dayton shooter to Warren. Please think about it more... I'm calling for consistency. I disagree with your arguments, but I want to see some consistency as well. The rhetoric of Trump (or GOP) didn't *contribute* to the El Paso shooter do the evil deed, just as the rhetoric of Warren (or Democrat) didn't *contribute* to the Dayton shooting to commit his evil deed. The state of our politics isn't new... it maybe exacerbated by cable news and social media. But, we've always had these sorts of gutter politics. My point was that we shouldn't be focusing on political rhetoric... there is a more fundamental problem that creates the scneario that leads these monsters to perpetuate their evil deeds. Not ashamed. Trump is NOT the victim... far from it. But, it's the same deliberative rationale that you're using to ascribe blame. Criticize all you want. I believe there are other factors that need to be addressed. Banning guns and or more gun control... or holding politicians accountable won't be the panacea you think it would. |
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Post by Disciple of Fate on Aug 7, 2019 11:41:26 GMT -5
So you made three claims (Warren/Dayton=Trump/El Paso, saying Trump is morally responsible=blaming rape victim, that critics are also responsible) and are unable to support any of them beyond handwaving "its the same", I think we're about done here...
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Post by Emblematic Wolfblade on Aug 7, 2019 11:54:05 GMT -5
Of course. I'm pretty sure whem is the only one able to somehow equate direct calls for violence with "good faith ribbing", refusal to elaborate on his claims, and continues to repeat false eqivulancies. So yeah, I think whem has once again proven he's a detriment to society.
But hey, why accept your side is the source of most domestic terrorism when you can blame the other side for being just as bad somehow?
(You'll also note, whem, I never said the left doesn't commit violence, I'm just arguing against this "both aides" bullshit you're trying to push, especially when you're trying to use the Dayton shooter as an example of politically motivated violence while denying the El Paso shooter was politically motivated.)
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Post by whemblycthulhu on Aug 7, 2019 11:56:58 GMT -5
So you made three claims (Warren/Dayton=Trump/El Paso, saying Trump is morally responsible=blaming rape victim, that critics are also responsible) and are unable to support any of them beyond handwaving "its the same", I think we're about done here... Okay. I guess you really don't want to have a discussion about it, other than placing all the blame on political rhetoric. |
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Post by whemblycthulhu on Aug 7, 2019 11:58:05 GMT -5
/// still ignores the point I'm trying to make and resorts to generalizations. why bother? /// God bless. |
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Post by Emblematic Wolfblade on Aug 7, 2019 11:58:33 GMT -5
Whem, you're not having a discussion. You're pulling fallacy after fallacy out of your ads while ignoring facts that everyone else has agreed on. Stop pretending you are, let alone you're engaging in good faith.
Case in point, you're inability to respond to anything I point out because you know you can't. You know you can't justify the xenophobic rhetoric, so you sidestep confronting the common cause of most of these mass shootings.
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Post by Disciple of Fate on Aug 7, 2019 12:04:25 GMT -5
Still engaging in that sweet sweet either/or absolutism
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Post by whemblycthulhu on Aug 7, 2019 12:10:31 GMT -5
Still engaging in that sweet sweet either/or absolutism Still unwilling to consider more fundamental problems and far more interested in weaponizing these tragedies for political purposes. |
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Post by Disciple of Fate on Aug 7, 2019 12:12:25 GMT -5
Fundamental problems like white supremacy and Trump peddling their rhetoric? I thought you were there for that discussion?
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Post by whemblycthulhu on Aug 7, 2019 12:14:47 GMT -5
Whem, you're not having a discussion. You're pulling fallacy after fallacy out of your ads while ignoring facts that everyone else has agreed on. Stop pretending you are, let alone you're engaging in good faith. Case in point, you're inability to respond to anything I point out because you know you can't. You know you can't justify the xenophobic rhetoric, so you sidestep confronting the common cause of most of these mass shootings. I refuse to engage with you. Period. You're not interested in good faith debates. So... God bless. |
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Post by whemblycthulhu on Aug 7, 2019 12:17:47 GMT -5
Fundamental problems like white supremacy and Trump peddling their rhetoric? I thought you we're there for that discussion? I'm saying there are other factors. Political rhetoric shouldn't even be the most influential reasons why he committed his heinous acts. How would you explain the Datyon shooting? |
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