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Post by Peregrine on Nov 6, 2024 5:46:42 GMT -5
It's just so depressing. Not only for what the next 4 years are going to be like (although I hope cooler heads in the lower ranks can convince their superiors to mollify some of Trumps crazier ideas), but what will happen to American politics and society in the years after. My desperate hope is that when Trump dies and the republicans no longer have his cult propping up their turnout the party collapses and we see a major realignment into something more sane. As horrific as it is that we failed the basic intelligence and empathy test the margins were still relatively small. It wouldn't take that much of a drop in turnout from the cult to turn 2024 into a democrat landslide. The biggest issue is going to be dealing with SCOTUS, we're almost certainly going to need some kind of court expansion or term limits to undo the damage we're likely going to suffer there. |
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skyth
OT Cowboy
Posts: 487
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Post by skyth on Nov 6, 2024 5:52:23 GMT -5
Well, at least we have an explanation for why right wingers are so convinced that people will fake being trans so they can win sporting events. After all, their hero can only win when he goes up against a woman...
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Post by Haighus on Nov 6, 2024 5:57:59 GMT -5
It's just so depressing. Not only for what the next 4 years are going to be like (although I hope cooler heads in the lower ranks can convince their superiors to mollify some of Trumps crazier ideas), but what will happen to American politics and society in the years after. My desperate hope is that when Trump dies and the republicans no longer have his cult propping up their turnout the party collapses and we see a major realignment into something more sane. As horrific as it is that we failed the basic intelligence and empathy test the margins were still relatively small. It wouldn't take that much of a drop in turnout from the cult to turn 2024 into a democrat landslide. The biggest issue is going to be dealing with SCOTUS, we're almost certainly going to need some kind of court expansion or term limits to undo the damage we're likely going to suffer there. That assumes the election will still be more or less a fair one in 2028. |
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mdgv2
Ye Olde King of OT
Posts: 917
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Post by mdgv2 on Nov 6, 2024 6:00:36 GMT -5
Farage already with his shitty snout up Trump’s ring, praising his “resilience”.
Stupidity and pigheadedness isn’t resilience. Nor is simply lying your way through life, ignoring anything even approaching the truth.
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Post by semipotentwalrus on Nov 6, 2024 6:09:57 GMT -5
So Trump's at around the same amount of votes that he had last time around while Harris is 13 million short of Biden's results. Haven't seen the numbers for independents but the prospect of 13 million fewer people voting than in 2020 is wild to me. The low voter participation in the US is a long-standing problem but that's one hell of a swing.
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Post by Peregrine on Nov 6, 2024 6:11:03 GMT -5
My desperate hope is that when Trump dies and the republicans no longer have his cult propping up their turnout the party collapses and we see a major realignment into something more sane. As horrific as it is that we failed the basic intelligence and empathy test the margins were still relatively small. It wouldn't take that much of a drop in turnout from the cult to turn 2024 into a democrat landslide. The biggest issue is going to be dealing with SCOTUS, we're almost certainly going to need some kind of court expansion or term limits to undo the damage we're likely going to suffer there. That assumes the election will still be more or less a fair one in 2028. It does. I suppose I'm not ready to seriously consider the possibility that it won't be. Though I guess it will probably be a moot point in my case, as that would mean enough of the far-right agenda would have passed that I'd be a refugee in Canada and no longer eligible to vote in the US. So Trump's at around the same amount of votes that he had last time around while Harris is 13 million short of Biden's results. Haven't seen the numbers for independents but the prospect of 13 million fewer people voting than in 2020 is wild to me. The low voter participation in the US is a long-standing problem but that's one hell of a swing. Of course the question is how much of that is a genuine drop in turnout and how much of it is successful voter suppression efforts by the republicans. |
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Post by pacific on Nov 6, 2024 6:50:27 GMT -5
Well, what a horrible shock today. You realise how their really is a cultural gulf across the pond (that we in the UK seem to do our best to follow, but can't quite reach the same extremes); how socially under-developed parts of the US are, how many are poorly educated and easily led to vote against their own interests.
I agree with @disciple of Fate's comment above - this is most likely the last time we will see a female candidate for president; if someone so well qualified can lose to one of the worst human beings, by any measure, and one with a such a marked track record of failure then the country is quite obviously not ready for a woman to lead them.
My hope now is that, being a massive narcissist, Trump's main motivation for the presidency was to avoid jail and stave off bankruptcy. As a 78-year old, and having seen how limp Biden's presidency appeared to be over the past couple of years, as a much lesser man he will retreat to his penthouse room with Big Mac in hand, and sit there on the phone all evening watching Fox News and blurting out nonsense on social media. Hopefully some of the truly evil people around him will struggle to get him to squiggle on some of those more egregious measures - but, for minorities in America now, for Ukraine, actually for every country in the world that is struggling to fight off populist movements and governments, we are going to have a difficult four years.
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Post by Disciple of Fate on Nov 6, 2024 7:00:32 GMT -5
I assume we will still see a significant increase for Harris from blue states that aren't done counting, but it would be a shock if she has lost the popular vote, given that Clinton managed that against the then unknown Trump expectations.
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Post by herzlos on Nov 6, 2024 7:03:47 GMT -5
So what now? From a rest of the world perspective, America becoming even less relevant and stable isn't quite the same issue. We don't need to visit and can mostly just avoid the smugness.
But for Americans, how do they avoid being totally screwed? Even if Trump is impeached again or the convictions prevent him continuing, you've still got Vance.
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Post by Disciple of Fate on Nov 6, 2024 7:06:53 GMT -5
My hope now is that, being a massive narcissist, Trump's main motivation for the presidency was to avoid jail and stave off bankruptcy. As a 78-year old, and having seen how limp Biden's presidency appeared to be over the past couple of years Biden suffered from a lack of Senate support, his margin was so small that Sinema and Manchin could basically block anything significant. Somehow, I don't think the incoming Republican senate majority will suffer from that issue... |
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Post by crispy78 on Nov 6, 2024 7:12:48 GMT -5
Best comment I've seen so far (in response to this article: www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2024/nov/06/election-trump-president-resistance-america)Hak_a_dalan 40 minutes ago 142 Guardian Pick "I know you’re scared and stressed. So am I.” Me too. But not half as much as I am angry. I am angry at Joe Biden for hanging on as long as he did, denying the Democratic Party a proper primary and denying their candidate a full run. I am angry at the Biden administration for spectacularly misjudging the American electorate, for failing to explain their economic strategy and for being utterly incapable of claiming credit for their policy successes. I am angry at Jill Biden for enabling her husband. I am angry at Biden’s inner circle for claiming that their man was up for four more years when it was obvious to everyone that he wasn’t. Their gaslighting is simply unforgiveable, shredding the Democratic Party of credibility in the eyes of many. I am angry at Merrick Garland for not pursuing Trump for his crimes sooner. I am angry at his timidity. I am angry at Mitch McConnell for not stopping all this at Trump’s impeachment in Jan. 2021. That craven, myopic partisan zealot had it within his power to end all this. I am angry at the Supreme Court for facilitating the ascendancy of a tyrant. I am angry at the media that continues to grade Trump on the most ridiculous of curves. I am angry at the American people for accepting Trump’s behaviours. I am angry at their failure to either understand the danger, or for the fact that they simply don’t seem to care. I am angry at the billionaires, and their craven avarice. I am angry. I am so fucking angry. But you know who I’m not angry at? Kamala Harris. She was dealt a difficult hand and she played it as well as anyone could have expected her to. Mr Reich says he still has faith in America. I fail to see how that is possible this morning. |
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mdgv2
Ye Olde King of OT
Posts: 917
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Post by mdgv2 on Nov 6, 2024 7:44:20 GMT -5
About all I can do is consciously do as little business with US companies as possible.
Ain’t much, but it is what it is,
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Post by crispy78 on Nov 6, 2024 7:47:25 GMT -5
About all I can do is consciously do as little business with US companies as possible. Ain’t much, but it is what it is, I fuckin work for one  |
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Post by pacific on Nov 6, 2024 7:56:28 GMT -5
My hope now is that, being a massive narcissist, Trump's main motivation for the presidency was to avoid jail and stave off bankruptcy. As a 78-year old, and having seen how limp Biden's presidency appeared to be over the past couple of years Biden suffered from a lack of Senate support, his margin was so small that Sinema and Manchin could basically block anything significant. Somehow, I don't think the incoming Republican senate majority will suffer from that issue... My glimmer of light here (and I am searching around in the darkness here for any, no matter how small) is how little energy Trump will have for the Presidency. There is a massive difference between 78 and 70, or even 78 and 74, in terms of how frail the human body becomes. I saw it with my Grandparents and am in the process of seeing it with my parents now. You saw it with Biden becoming notably doddery - I know the President's staff is responsible for so much (see: Ronald Reagan and Bush Jr) but the man at the centre has got to have that energy. Trump himself has grown progressively worse to the point where really he should have been sat in his Florida resort, in front of a widescreen TV and with a blanket over his lap, full-fat coke in hand and shouting at the TV. And so one hope I hold is that he will become a lame president. A Henry VI, effectively rolled around and wheeled out, shouting obscenities, when his handlers can try and get him to sign some paper. And a lot of damage to the minorities within the US will depend on how successful the group of reprobates around him are at steering him. crispy78 - I agree with everything you said there. Beyond anger, I am just so disappointed. A very spirited and combative piece by Robert Reich here www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2024/nov/06/election-trump-president-resistance-america |
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carlo87
Ye Olde King of OT
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Post by carlo87 on Nov 6, 2024 8:00:54 GMT -5
Apparently comes down to PA. Again. Looks like Trump will get Pennsylvania, but he wouldn't have needed it. Final score looks to be 312 to 226. Eight years ago today Cenk Uygur of the Young Turks called Hillary "the worst candidate in history." Heck, at least she managed 234 electoral votes and the popular vote. Kamala won't manage either. |
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